Non-intercourse fooling around casually before disclosure?

[dani]

I recently was diagnosed and have found some of the discussions on this forum pretty helpful.

 

In the aftermath of my diagnosis, my mind has run through a lot of previous encounters I've had with women - many of which happened very spontaneously while traveling out of country, and were often pursued aggressively by the girl rather than by me - and wondered how they would have gone differently if I had disclosed beforehand. I've read "hippyherpy" 's thread "The Ladies Man Disclosure Thread," which has given me some inspiration that perhaps at least some of the girls would have been fine with proceeding even if I had disclosed. But I'm mentally walking through another hypothetical scenario that I haven't seen anyone write about, in which I go out to bar/nightclub and talk to girl, girl expresses interest in going home with me, I say yes, when we get back to my place I say clearly - but, I don't want to have sex or oral sex yet (for personal reasons), but we can do other things, then we fool around but I avoid genital to genital contact (hand to genital still on the table). Then, on a later night, if she's interested in meeting again in the future, I tell her: the reason I didn't want to have sex that night was because I have genital herpes, which I wanted to make sure you are ok with before we go further.

 

I think the reason the reason I'm thinking about this approach is because it preserves some of the spontaneity of the encounters I've enjoyed which have progressed fairly fast sexually, without putting the pressure of disclosure on the first night. In a more traditional relationship/dating set up it would make sense to disclose before doing anything beyond kissing - but I'm wondering if anyone has ever had success with this kind of casual encounter and then disclosing afterwards.

[Miji69]

Hi @dani

 

In answer to your question, yes. I have had in the past and currently gone past kissing (hand to genital (his) ) before disclosing. I understand what you say about spontaneity. It sometimes feels in certain situations like it keeps the development of a relationship as organic as possible before it has to go *there*

There's a risk in that though... Without the other presumed negative person being educated to how herpes can be transmitted, they could initially have a freak out moment as you disclose and before you then give them the facts. It might feel like you withheld from them whilst being sexual and that's not helpful when trying to have that talk. You may have the added responsibility of explaining the low risk of passing herpes via your hand (if you were to go straight from your genitals to theirs)

I can only speak for myself and say, I haven't personally found this a no go area being done carefully but each to their own but I wouldn't recommend that as such.

[dani]

thanks @Miji69. so, to be clear, you have done it before but wouldn't necessarily recommend it? can I ask how it went when you did do it - did partners react in the way you're suggesting, and anybody get chased away by the feeling that you'd hidden something from them ? I guess my hope would be that after I explain how nearly impossible it is to transfer via hand contact, they would be appreciative that I was protecting them by not having sex on that night and waiting to disclose to them outside the heat of the moment.

 

on the subject of spontaneity, I know Adrial and this forum are big on the idea that disclosing can create a deeper sense of intimacy and connection between potential partners, which I'm sure is true... but in my mind budding relationships aren't alway just about intimacy - they're also about passion, and the excitement of something new before you truly know the person. And there's no escaping the fact that needing to disclose takes away some of that excitement. but if this scenario worked out at least it would preserve some of it... guess the only way to learn is to try it.

 

 

 

 

[Miji69]

Hi @dani. Yes, I have in the past but it was with people who were pretty clued up in a general sense about std transmissions. In other words, they weren't the 'type' to freak out. Some people may not want to have a sexual relationship with you but from stories here, that rejection needn't be a negative thing. I wouldn't recommend it because there is a chance that person MAY react badly if they aren't that worldly or educated to the risks. That could be hurtful for them and you if you are emotionally invested.

 

I get what you say about passion and spontaneity and there's no reason to spoil that as long as you're playing fair. It's a problem I have at the moment in a thread I started and I struggle with that but there is also a lot to gain from the type of intimacy that doesn't involve sex... yet. I don't have the links to hand but you should watch some of Adrial's videos on intimacy and there is a great success story called Tonight is MY night with a guy called @NSgreenville which will give you an insight into how honesty, integrity and intimacy can lead to a beautiful outcome. I know that you're not necessarily looking for a long term relationship but I guess what I'm saying is, that only serves as a safeguard in disclosing because what have you got to lose if you're not emotionally invested anyway? Hell of a lot more to lose by worrying over the risks and the guilt.

:)

[Miji69]

Also, sorry, to answer your main question, I would not go directly from myself to a partner with my hand as I think that's risky. I'm also not ok with a guy touching me *down there* if I have not disclosed yet. Having said all that, when I disclosed to a previous partner after that, it wasn't an issue for him and we went on to have a short relationship.

[dani]

well, I think there's just been a very specific way that I've done things in the past of meeting people at hostels/bars/nightclubs and the feeling that "anything can happen tonight" - and it makes me sad if I can't have that level of spontaneity anymore. from reading @hippyherpy's thread it seems like he does disclosures once they've arrived back at the bedroom - and that's something that I personally don't have a moral problem with, but my fear is that the girls, even if they accept the herpes in the heat of the moment, might panic the next morning, precluding the possibility of a further relationship continuing. so that's why I envisioned this scenario... maybe another possibility would be disclosure on the first night, but then also suggesting that we stick to non-intercourse activities so that they can make sure they're ok with the risks in a less heated time before we go further.

 

or, maybe I just need to accept that any form of first night hookup isn't as much of a possibility anymore, and the best approach is to slow down a bit - get a girl's number, make out with her, but then meet her again a couple times before disclosing and hopefully proceeding further. that's difficult for me to accept in that it takes away some of the excitement of the process I'm used to, but c'est la vie. probably the only way to figure out what works is to try different approaches...

 

[hippyherpy]

Girls are usually cool with it once they decide. I had one girl message me a couple weeks after about it, but she got confirmed negative for it.

 

The bigger a deal you make out it then it needs to be, the bigger a deal it will probably be for them.

 

Remember, almost nobody gets disclosed to, so you are setting an example for her. It's almost your duty to everyone else not to make a big deal out of it in order to help fight the stigma. Be honest about it, but also show them that herpes isn't such a big deal by being cool about the whole thing.